January and February numbers were dismal.
"Demand continued to fall for professional services, such as business consultants, accountants and legal services. The Boston region reported 'dismal' business for temporary staffing firms. A New York company noted that activity by a major employment agency 'virtually ground to a halt.'"
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090304/ap_on_bi_ge/fed_economy
50 comments:
Someone got paid to write that article. We already knew this months ago.
I think it is worse now. At the end of last year, I was at least getting some calls. The work might have been short term, but at least it was something. Since New Years I haven't been getting ANYTHING. Aside from that S & C gig which just purged a large group of people and that HHR monstrosity that is only accepting unlicensed JD's, is there anything else going on?
This blog is the most depressing thing I have ever read.
I remember getting a call or two December or January for work in Wilmington or suburban Philly.
It was low end rates- $30 flat.
But maybe we will start seeing increased document requests once the Obama DOJ starts doing some work.
And the Wyeth v Levine may get some pharma work going in a year or so...
we need to realize that doc review is over, at least for now. the days of easy money and mindless clicking have ended. it's best if we face this sooner rather than later and find our "true calling", whatever that is.
At least you people got called in December. My last project ended in September and the phone's been quiet ever since. Aside from that horrific Westfield gig.
this article more or less puts the India thing (meaning reviews in India re the reason we re all out of work) to rest, no?
also, the paragraph quoted that temporary staffing agencies are having problems, thats across industries...not just legal staffing.
when the economy improves, or maybe even levels out, things will improve, whether we all want to wait that long is another question...
How does it put the India thing to rest?
You know how much accounting is flooding into India now?
It's over. You've all been suckered by the Beast called Corporate America.
You're all doomed. It's too late to save yourselves.
It's over.
I hope starbucks is hiring.
430
Playing likelihoods. What's more likely- an outsourcing process that was expected to take years to develop, which only this site has claimed has happened in 3 or 4 months (since we are talking since Oct or Nov), OR (Occam's razor) that it's the downturn in the economy, which happened at the same time and has harmed everyone else (including big law firms which are shedding associates by the hundreds), is the culprit? Believe what you want, but that belief should be linked to facts and probabilities.
4:49 is right. It's not like only doc reviewers are out of work. The economy crashed and the legal market went into freefall.
White collar workers are SCREWED. Heavy student loan debt, no social safety net, private 201K retirement acccounts, etc, etc. Unless you can fix roads or work in construction, you are better off leaving this country.
i hear welding is a good field to get in to these days. really.
Another document review NOT for admitted attorneys:
PARALEGALS-DOCUMENT REVIEW
Reply to: job-wqvwb-1060526462@craigslist.org [Errors when replying to ads?]
Date: 2009-03-04, 5:04PM EST
Established Insurance Defense firm is seeking
2-3 very computer savvy paralegals for a 2+
month assignment reviewing internal e-mail
records. The work location is in Jamaica, Queens
and involves a computer program called
Group Wise. A plus if you have this software
experience, but not required. Please send resume to:
Fax: 212-867-6617 dwex@agalegal.com [Edit]
The handwriting has been on the wall for years -- the legal profession is a bloated mess fed by the student loan bubble. The big firms are going to fall like houses of cards because their corporate clients just can't afford to pay $400/hr for some first year associate who knows nothing.
There's no future in this. I'm paying off my loans and getting out.
So much for the geniuses who claimed that paralegals aren't taking work away from us.
I'm moving to Europe.
So long suckers.
Fuck doc review.
Fuck the agencies.
Fuck biglaw.
Fuck the ABA.
Fuck corporate America.
Fuck all of you.
7:50- Who told you Europeans are better off than we are? This is hitting them as bad as us. GO teach English in China if you want to pay the bills.
Another paralegal review
Paralegal Temps needed for month long project in Northern Virginia. This position requires a car because its location is not accessible by public transportation. Requirements include a BA or BS degree together with computer skills that include MS Word and Excel. The project comprises document review, entry of summary information into a database and other related projects. Starts March 16 or 23. Please send resumes to Susan@pattaylor.com. No JDs please.
Location: Northern Virginia
Compensation: $16-17/hour
Much of Europe has a higher cost of living and higher unemployment than NYC. Also, it is damn near impossible to get a work visa there.
"GO teach English in China if you want to pay the bills."
Actually China has the lowest paying jobs. Go to Korea for $30 or $40k tax free, free housing and cheap cost of living.
Japan is a better deal, too.
They're not doing YOUR work. Nobody could be that stupid. Unauthorized practice of law, etc. That's also exactly why they don't want a JD on it. They're probably pre-coding docs or doing something in anticipation of litigation.
You ought to be happy something is starting to happen out there.
Anybody have insight as to defaulting on private loans?
Is the worst they can do garnishment if you have no other assets (or your domicile is protected as a 'homestead')? Would I just be looking at a trashed credit score and potential wage attachment?
8:28 even when you see it in black and white you still don't understand it or just refuse to admit it. Paralegals are doing our work. Lots of it.
pffft. There is work, just find a good recruiter and hound them until the give you work. The squeaky wheel gets the oil.
Be nice to the recruiters, very nice.
It seems to me that for a dcocument review to be conducted effectively, the law form associates have to be on site working with the document reviewers. I don't see how you can have that situation with either outsourcing or onsourcing.
Is it just me or does 8:42 sound like a recruiter looking for a kickback or something else like that in return for work?
When you register with a recruiter, close the office door and casually put a couple of hundred dollar bills on the table.
How do you think the Nigerians are getting all the work at Sullivan?
9:16, now that you mention the point, it's no longer just you.
But even if the recruiter will take a kickback, you won't get anywhere if there's no work.
HHR monstrosity that is only accepting unlicensed JD's?
You guys complain too much. Go back to grad school in something useful like math, science, or engineering. Ride out the wave of this recession on the surf board of government debt. Who cares? It's low interest and tax deductible and if you're lucky, you might be able to leverage some of that debt to pay off other higher rate debt. I'm going back to get a software engineering degree, as my law degree is useless. The outsourcing in IT isn't that bad. I know many engineers who now make above $100k. There are daily posts in Monster for java developers. It's a wide open field, compared to most.
i agree with the pp. take this opportunity to get out of the legal field.
I'm not an economist so maybe someone has some insight here: is doc review simply on a temporary downturn, and work will come back in a couple of months, as some people here like to claim? OR, has the biglaw business model started to implode, with contract-based doc review becoming a permanent casualty? I have no proof of this, but something tells me the latter is more true - biglaw will be assigning doc review to junior associates to keep them busy. The people on here who tell us to be patient never offer any substance to their optimistic claims.
it's clear that even many economists (Bernanke included) don't have a good handle on things. my guess is that doc review is not coming back in several months. it will take YEARS for this mess to unwind.
A bit of humor about the CNBC:
http://www.dailykostv.com/w/000949/
Has the BigLaw model started to implode?
I think big commerical litigation is going to be around for a while- large companies will continue to have contract disputes, pharma companies will continue to be sued.
Will companies (clients) be more cost-conscious? Sure. They're going to squeeze law firms on billing rates. One way to do it is to split work between firms (forcing them to compete). Another is to directly go to temp agencies to handle the discovery.
Our competition will be all the recently available associates and recent grads. I see lower rates, reviews in cheaper locations and more restrictive work conditions.
To quote Baron Harkonnen, squeeze, squeeze, squeeze!
The outsourcing in IT isn't that bad.
___________________________________
You are as dumb, and out of touch with reality, as a bag of rocks. Outsourcing BEGAN with tech jobs, and the few that remain here are being handed over to H1B-holders for half the salary paid to experienced American citizens. Are all lawyers this insular and self-absorbed?
Outsourcing for white collar professionals maybe....but outsourcing as a corporate model actually began with blue collar workers.....and no one said a damn thing because it wasn't happening to them at the time--but now, every white collar worker is screaming.....
8:39
You're right. I already have an IT related degree and am tooling up to find a job in web/software development. It's not completely flooded like the legal market.
12:31: I am not dumb. My husband is a software engineer and 5 years out of school he's now making over $100k as a consultant. He used to work for a major med company that scrapped the outsourcing model b/c the Indian developers couldn't get it together and it was costing the company more money than hiring home grown talent.
At any rate, do a Monster.com search for Java developers, and you'll see a TON of listings.
I agree that IT outsourcing is there, but it is not nearly the scare that everyone thinks it is.
Anon 12:09 said: "Another is to directly go to temp agencies to handle the discovery."
Will a law firm be able to use the results of a discovery process it has not supervised itself? How would this work? Just a question - I don't have an answer but have wondered about this. Thanks.
To follow up on my question to Anon 12:09, I wonder if the answer is not a temp agency, but another, cheaper law firm that takes responsibility for the integrity of the results. But then are there licensing issues?
12:31
Also keep in mind that the Obama administration is trying to curb outsorcing.
Anon 3:29-
I'm thinking that clients would directly contract with agencies to prevent cost-plus pricing.
Day-to-day management and QC could also be done by agency lawyers.
A boutique discovery firm to handle everything from collections to review could also fill this niche, leaving the other litigation functions to another firm.
so- a question, for anyone not getting unemployment checks, how are you getting an income? I'm looking for ideas here. Lap dancing is absolutely a last resort.
PARALEGALS-DOCUMENT REVIEW
Reply to: job-wqvwb-1060526462@craigslist.org [Errors when replying to ads?]
Date: 2009-03-04, 5:04PM EST
Established Insurance Defense firm is seeking
2-3 very computer savvy paralegals for a 2+
month assignment reviewing internal e-mail
records. The work location is in Jamaica, Queens and involves a computer program called Group Wise. A plus if you have this software experience, but not required. Please send resume to:
Fax: 212-867-6617 dwex@agalegal.com [Edit]
THIS JOB PAYS $13 AN HOUR AND WAS WITH AUDREY GOLDEN ASSOCIATES!!! THEY ARE TOTAL LAME-OOS.
A professional staffing agency operates with a focus on particular sectors of the job market.This service can be advantageous for several reasons.
Overseas Recruitment Agencies
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