"Tom,
I have learned that Milbank intends to come after anyone who disparages the firm
online. In fact the info earlier this year about 'Ally' caused the firm
to rise to her defense. But apparently the firm is finally waking up conducting
private interview with the temp and perm discovery attorneys to find out what
the problem is. It is almost hard to believe that the firm is so oblivious to
'Ally' being the problem. Nobody trusts or respects her."
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51 comments:
And how does Milbank plan on discovering who disparages the firm online? Are they going to invoke the Patriot Act? Use some high-tech technology?
All firms and agencies can assure that no one disparages them online by treating their temporary attorneys with a modicum of professional respect instead of treating them like Michael Vick's dogs.
Workers who are being treated respectfully and professionally do better work and don't bite the hand that feeds them. Abusive hands always get bitten eventually.
It's interesting that such highly educated, well-off professionals need to be reminded of this basic fact of human (and dog) nature.
But, as previous comments on past postings have fleshed out, the powers-that-be are certainly book smart, but sorely lacking in common sense intelligence.
I assure you that contract attorneys have to be treated more harshly than dogs -- if only because dogs can learn.
If you don't really stomp down on them, temp attorneys will simply surf the web for half the day and talk on the cellphone for the other half. They don't want the project to finish -- they want nice, steady employment. Thus, without strict control of the temps, work will never get done.
If contract attorneys were responsible, trustworthy, and worked hard, they'd be associates in law firms.
Well put. In many ways, I must agree with you. There are a lot of lazy, irresponsible people working as contract attorneys. How they made it through law school and passed a bar exam is beyond my comprehension. They couldn't get a permanent job as a secretary or doorman, let alone as an associate. There are even some foreign folks without a command of the English language reviewing English documents. And foreign language reviews where people aren't fluent in the language. (The agencies would send a dead-for-ten-years cadaver to these jobs if they could get away with it. Anything for a buck.)
But there are also very good people working as temps who are there for various reasons. Maybe they went to a crappy law school and can't get a permanent job in NY that pays a 'livable salary' - 'livable' meaning one that covers the high cost of living in the NY area, as well as monthly student loan payments. As we know, these Toilet Law Firms want to pay you $40k and work you 95 hrs per week. Even the salary paid by the DA's office is not equal to the high cost of living in NY. Now THAT is scary.
We must admit - contract attorneys who get steady work make more than permanent attorneys at toilet law firms or ADAs.
On the firm's side, it's quite evident that management is sorely lacking at these temp projects. The associate(s) in charge should monitor people to see who's producing and who isn't. Have second review occur while temps are still doing first review, in order to see who's coding accurately and who's just clicking whatever.
Fire the people who don't produce or who don't give a damn. Keep the people who do (at least those who care enough to do a decent job - I'm not advocating "Supertempism").
Don't punish every contract attorney because some are lazy/incompetent. Just get rid of the lazy/incompetent ones.
Treating everyone like crap is only going to make the work product worse: the lazy people are going to keep doing a bad job, and the good people are going to get fed up and either stop caring or leave for greener pastures.
So much whining and complaining going on...just do your work act professionally. This goes for everyone...but the problems persist because the law is such a stratified profession and everyone is treated like dogs (even low-producing partners get canned).
I've worked on some projects that were extremely well run and others that have approached criminal enterprises. It's a crapshoot.
But the one thing that everyone controls is how they behave on the work site. We all know that if we are getting paid we should not spend our time on personal phone calls or shopping online. Keep quite and respect those working with you. Don't grab all of the free food leaving nothing for others.
Ultimately you will usually get
what you deserve as a contract attorney, what you put into it you will get out, subject to the inherent limitations of the position (no benefits, no career path, no status, etc.). It's a straight economic exchange, work for pay. Don't expect to be treated like a summer associate or you will be severely disappointed. Contract attorneys are beneath the staff paralegals on the totem pole. Get over it or find another line of work.
1:56 - Do you think it's right that contract attorneys are beneath staff paralegals on the totem pole?
Do you think this blog has awakened firms to the fact that there are problems in the current way things are handled regarding contract attorneys? I think it's made them realize they have to address these issues and fix them - outsoucing to Bangalore isn't a realistic answer, given the possible legal/malpractice ramifications.
Do you think the bad press here has hurt the reputations of Quinn Emanuel, Kirkland & Ellis, Paul Weiss, etc.?
How about the reputations of agencies like Lexolution, E.P. Dine, Hudson, and Update?
I think it has. The more abusive they get in response to the blogging, the worse the press is going to get. I hope they've become wise to this fact.
I agree with you about the personal phone calls, especially when someone has to talk at the top of her lungs about personal issues in the middle of the caseroom.
And I hate the mad dash to the free food, too. But there's very little free food offered - very few of these firms put out spreads for the contract attorneys. I guess that's why when it's there, some temps trip all over themselves to stack 12 sandwiches, a mountain of salad, and 19 cookies on their plates. They want to make up for "past starvation."
That's just a psychological issue on their part. It's not a general characteristic of contract attorneys.
2:21 astutely noted:
"And I hate the mad dash to the free food, too. But there's very little free food offered - very few of these firms put out spreads for the contract attorneys. I guess that's why when it's there, some temps trip all over themselves to stack 12 sandwiches, a mountain of salad, and 19 cookies on their plates. They want to make up for 'past starvation.'"
This unprofessional-appearing behavior is almost as bad as the performance of the job of most of my fellow contract attorneys (there's a reason they are here and not "movers and shakers"). I've had people sitting next to me with ADHD, taking Adderall (a prescription amphetimine for treating ADD and ADHD), and after agonizing over a single document for an hour I suggest one of the twelve available tags so that he doesn't get fired. If you have to borrow $100,000 in student loans there is a reason, in most cases.
As aptly noted in other comments, ttt tries to look out for us (thank you!), but it's insubstantial ridiculous postings such as this that are unhelpful. The web is anonymous: No one is going to track you by you IP address and sue you.
Votes: Tom, thanks for keeping the blog fun! But that's all it is. It wastes our time when we check your blog for helpful insights, and discourages us from checking for astute posts as often.
Can you please return to your helpful work on our behalf, such as last year's September American Lawyer Magazine posting that told us about Howrey's facility in Virginia? Many of us would have missed such factual and truly pertinent material. This is a career we are for whatever reason doing. This is about money, not Six Flags (we thought).
Think! We not care how my fellow readers feel about a particular agency: Once you have kindly helped us find out, accurately, with facts NOT obtained by disgruntled employees, that agency is no longer in our thoughts. Why not look at what's going on NOW, and look forward, as you used to do. Perhaps there is a larger percentage of people than you think, who don't care about a big project gone bad that you used to work on two years ago?
Look at your helpful links. For example, DC Metro Contract Attorneys, and how the wages in that market have risen to $40 per hour in such a short time. Maybe a return to your great posting about current (and accurate) issues like that would not bother you? It's your blog, so we appreciate all you have done. Please stay cool and keep telling us helpful things, not impossible stories from a few malcontents who just got dropped from a project and want to lash out. It's probably just some punk from Teaneck who saw a successful lawyer as a child and is trying to mimic what he (by his very presence here) cannot.
Thanks,
Former Reader who is trying to return, but finds useless entries still rule your formerly blemishless blog.
3:14, c'mon now.
Maybe there hasn't been anything "newsworthy" (by your standards) out there lately. I'm sure if there was, Tom would've posted it.
I like the satire and sarcasm that's been up here as of late. It makes the blog more "real." Newspapers have editorial sections, right?
Does it have to be one or the other? Why can't the blog have both seriousness and satire? Personally, I'm glad Tom does very little censoring.
Guess you're a NY Times reader. They take themselves VERY seriously......
I do agree with you about the people with ADD and other mental disorders on the job, though.
The agencies will place people with Tourette's Syndrome, Multiple Personality Disorder, OCD, ADD, Mental Retardation, Bipolar Disorder, Tripolar Disorder, and/or any other disorder you can think of on a project if they can get away with it. They especially have a field day when the firm hires based upon resumes only, without an interview. Then they can place the dead-for-ten years cadavers on the job, which might make them a few grand up until the point where the firm realizes that the cadavers' production is a little low.
ANYTHING FOR A BUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!
THE OMNIPRESENCE OF TOM THE TEMP
The unusual preoccupation that many law firms and individual lawyers have with regards to the individual identity of Tom the Temp illustrates simple ignorance and the inability to grasp the greater significance or relevance of what is truly important.
Robert Reich, President Clinton’s former Secretary of Labor once stated that the most valuable thing an individual has to give is their labor. In a fair and just society an employee is rewarded for their earnest and legitimate spirit of hard work. When an individual is respected for their hard work with a fair wage, honorable treatment and good working conditions, the continued loyalty and devotion of the worker are inspired resulting in increased productivity and profits and less turnover. When there is insincerity in approach, a hostile working environment or an effort to profit excessively off of that effort without sharing it with the employee the equation breaks down. While the long term profitability of the company/firm is paramount, there is no honor when the profits are not shared equitably. Employees at every level are critical to sustain long term profitability of an entity. Profitability and equitable treatment are not diametrically opposed concepts.
The Legal Profession in modern America unfortunately resembles “The Boulevard of Broken Dreams”. Many legal professionals are ambitious people who worked hard, borrowed a great deal of money that they may never be able to pay back for programs in American law schools that provided and continue to provide unrealistic expectations about the opportunities available to graduates upon graduation. The educational establishment is bankrupting a generation and the Treasury with the illusion that an investment in their tuition supporting their professors and administration is a wise investment, all while the default rate on student debt continues to climb and desperation mounts with so many scavengers and predators who have created a Ponzi scheme where recruiters and firms gorge themselves on the backs of temporary workers. When you look with disdain at the “Temps” or you encourage your employees to do so, you illustrate your morality. These “temps” are people too, many of whom had dreams to be Perry Mason, Alan Dershowitz, F. Lee Bailey, Clarence Darrow or Marty Lipton and not Perry Doc Review. So consider how you treat that individual who is driving up the profits of your firms, enabling your lifestyle and treat them with respect. They are not necessarily living their dream working for you but many do come with a strong work ethic to work hard, earn money to pay their rent, payoff their student loans and otherwise try to make a living.
There are many firms where legal professionals are leased to law firms by the agencies at rates upwards of $75 per hour while the firms themselves turn around and bill these interim staffers to their clients at the rates of a first or second year associates in excess of $200 per hour , all while the interim staffers have their rates pushed down as close to rates as close to the $30 per hour level as possible. Furthermore, they are often asked to work in conditions where they are watched like hawks, have limited break time and have to deal with supervisors who create a hostile working environment. Acknowledge that sometimes a firm will hire the wrong temp but that also they may have hired the wrong Supervisor with a questionable agenda that is contrary to the interests of others.
So while you go consider going on a Witch Hunt to uncover the whistle blowers in your firms, remember that you illustrate your morality when you intimidate your own employees from being able to speak up in earnest, without fear of retribution, so that they have no choice but to see a therapist, take anti-depressants or write into a blog. What does that say of your firm culture that people leave, get fired and are otherwise undermined if they question the conduct and treatment of your supervisors all while you look the other way at their numerous indiscretions. Instead you direct your focus on review of their email and auditing their internet usage. If you bill them out like associates maybe you ought to treat them like associates or at least professionals, rather than indentured servants.
Tom the Temp is Omnipresent. Tom’s spirit lives in every firm where Fair Employment Practices are not their to protect us.
So look in the mirror, Tom the Temp is on every project, he is sitting next to you, he is a paralegal, he is an associate, he is a she, he has a friend who is a temp, he is your friend and he is your enemy and he may at times even yes, be YOU. I pray for a world where Tom the Temp is not necessary but unfortunately that may never happen..... WE ARE ALL TOM THE TEMP.
Bravo, 10:47!
Tom, can you put up 10:47's comment as a post so more people will see it instead of having it buried as just another comment? I think it's fantastically written!
If you oppress one of us, you oppress all of us, and you oppress yourself. If you oppress us, you will not be free, you will not make your own decisions, you will live in fear of the day that you lose control, and that your children become the fuel for the fire that feeds us all. You will live in fear of the day when that which you have taken from us, is taken from you.
You can bruise us, you can abuse us, you can break us, but you will have to answer to us. You can say what you want, but dear sirs, please take notice, you can say nothing against truth.
Ultimately you will usually get
what you deserve as a contract attorney
Can you provide any objective, empirical evidence to support this assertion? Can you even precisely what a contract attorney does or doesn't "deserve"?
In a vicious, oppressive hierarchical caste structure (which the legal profession is) a primary goal of those in power is to make those subservient seem weak, inept, or lazy. It gives the power structure credence.
6:22 - It's a primary goal to make people who are absolutely no threat to their position (temps) seem weak, inept, or lazy? I can see if it's a rival for one's position, but temps pose no threat to any associate or partner.
Could it just be sadism? Or a need to pass along abuse that's been passed onto them?
The abuse chain goes like this (1 being top abuser):
1) Client
2) Senior partner(s)
3) Junior partner(s)
4) Senior associate(s)
5) Junior associate(s)
6) Staff attorney(s) & Paralegals (I don't think paras take any shit from staff attorneys. They only take shit from "real" lawyers)
938) Temp attorneys
Just what threat do temps pose to those with vested interests in the firm?
vested? really? as oppsed the unvested interests?
I concur with the Omnipresence of "Tom The Temp"....law firms and agencies who do not engage in Fair Employment Practices and otherwise manipulate, deceive, harass or create a hostile working enviornment for attorneys, contract/temp or permanent must understand that the workforce at all levels in America has become more transient over the last decade. Combined with the wide spread dissemination of information via the internet and realize you have in essence created your own NEGATIVE PR. Defamation? TRUTH IS AN ABSOLUTE DEFENSE. As a result, many professionals (lawyers, paralegals and administrative staff) will shy away from hell holes like Paul Weiss. Those who speak the TRUTH from the depths of legal hell on earth, at places like Paul Weiss, are not traders to their profession. They are merely reporting what they see. When EP Dine attempts to hold back pay from attorneys who resign from "temporary" jobs the world should know. If we are truly "temporary" and can get the shaft at any time well then bitches, so can you. It is a two way street and to imply otherwise is dishonest. And to those "Supertemps" who kiss up to power and undermine their co-workers in a veiled but futile attempt to move up, do know that there will be a special place in hell for you. Imagine SATAN wearing a SPIKED STRAP ON DILDO for your pleasure upon your arrival. Bend over. The most corrupt thing that anyone can do is to undermine the ability of an honest, hardworking individual to earn a pay check. So do us all a favor do not use my back in your climb up the ladder.
It's a TEMPORARY job, folks. If it sucks, walk away. The ONLY reason the firms and the agencies get away with it is because YOU participate in the system.
90% of the people I met on projects are not capable of the high-powered jobs they think they "deserve" - they aren't smart enough, and they have no idea how to work hard.
Document review requires no skill, no effort, no talent beyond shutting up and showing up on time. They bitched about car service and meals and the pay, but they wouldn't work overtime hours, and a MONKEY could do what they do. If you aren't willing to work hard to make someone else money, no one needs you. So when your precious work gets sent off the midwest and India and the lawyer welfare system won't buy you dinner after spending 12 hours surfing the internet - what will you do then?
GET A FUCKING SKILL!!!!! Go find out what it means to work for a living.
If document review is all you can do - you don't deserve six figures. You deserve a paper hat and a name badge.
And yeah - I've got student loans and bills, too. SO I WENT OUT AND GOT A JOB. Try it.
i swear, i think the characters from the star wars bar scene have moved on to a 2nd career as doc reviewers. have you seen them?
1. obese older dude who wears shorts in the winter but still sweats like a bastard and showers you when he attempts to speak. guy, take the marbles out of your mouth.
2. the lady who looks either 84 or 14, depending on the angle. hearing the voice while she looks 84 is mind-blowing. i'm afraid to make eye-contact. it places the lotion in the basket and does as its told.
3. the guy who hordes all the free shit, either stuffing his bag for home, or delivering it to the receptionists hoping to get a slice. i think he unrolls the remaining shite paper after he's done dropping a deuce too. come on erkel, give it up.
4. this one's always funny. fresh out of law school chooch who only dresses in a suit when its "go out to lunch with the skank" day. hey, donger...just say no to the pinkie ring.
5. rip van winkle. he sleeps. he bills. he sleeps. he bills. angencies love him. i don't know how he has a job.
i know you've seen them. there are more, but i'll leave that for another time.
and you wonder why we get dumped on. enjoy the misery. i do.
The cell phone stalker, roaming the hallways talking loudly, double billing, annoying everyone that walks by.
The house mother, old lady, experienced lawyer, knows it all, constantly chats up the staff perm attys or paras.
The chair jockey, will work every last hour, will be the first to arrive and the last to leave...every day work is available.
The Toilet grad, recent TTT grad, talks as if they think they are a real lawyer, but knows zilch and been in school for their whole life, $160k in debt and a leased BMW; a toilet degree with low grades. Thinks they've hit the big time with meals and car service reimbursed by the firm. Gets car every night.
Jeez. You guys are even assholes to your co-workers. I can't understand why none of the good firms are hiring you.
10:35, it's called humor, satire, and hyperbole.
How many times do I have to remind some humorless person about this?
Anonymous said...
90% of the people I met on projects are not capable of the high-powered jobs they think they "deserve" - they aren't smart enough, and they have no idea how to work hard.
Why are law schools producing so many graduates who aren't capable of "high-powered" jobs as attorneys? If they aren't smart enough or hard-working enough for such jobs, why were they admitted to law school, graduated from law school, and licensed to practice? Doesn't it seem a little odd to you that all of a sudden, there's a plethora of credentialed people who aren't "capable" of doing the work that they were trained to do? Doesn't that suggest that something more systemic has changed beyond their individual characters and qualifications?
"Doesn't it seem a little odd to you that all of a sudden, there's a plethora of credentialed people who aren't "capable" of doing the work that they were trained to do? Doesn't that suggest that something more systemic has changed beyond their individual characters and qualifications?"
Not all legal jobs are "high-powered." It's always been the case that the vast majority of lawyers (especially from lower-tier schools) work on run of the mill divorces, home closings, criminal and traffic matters, wills and basic torts. Anyone who can pass the bar is probably "capable" of handling this kind of work. I think the problem is that loans have gotten so high that this bread and butter sort of work doesn't pay enough (at least until you have some experience) to provide a decent living.
I also think the poster at 2:16 was talking about big firm jobs or jobs that pay big firm salaries. The stakes are really high with big firm work. Firms are constantly evaluated by clients based on the quality of their work and the quality of their associates. Individual partners are under tremdous pressure to keep clients happy. Putting yourself in the position of a partner, would you rather entrust one of your prescious clients to a middle of the pack student from a lower tier school or would you go with the Columbia and NYU grads you've always hired? The random temp might be "capable" of doing high-end work, but if they couldn't shine or handle the pressure of exams at a third-tier school, you wouldn't assume that they'd thrive in the ultra-stressful world of biglaw.
"Why are law schools producing so many graduates who aren't capable of "high-powered" jobs as attorneys?"
Why don't you take responsibility for your decisions? You should do some more homework besides looking at school brochures before making at 100k+ investment? Would you buy a car from just looking at the salesperson's brochure? Probably not.
"Why don't you take responsibility for your decisions? You should do some more homework besides looking at school brochures before making at 100k+ investment?"
The crap state of the legal job market was not readily apparent during the 2002-2004 timeframe. For people applying to law school NOW, there is plenty of evidence that law school is a poor investment for most people.
WRONG! I started school in 2001 and the crap state of the market was evident to anyone with a brain. There was a recession. Lots of people lost their jobs. You probably remember reading something in the news about that.
Anonymous said...
"Why are law schools producing so many graduates who aren't capable of "high-powered" jobs as attorneys?"
Why don't you take responsibility for your decisions? You should do some more homework besides looking at school brochures before making at 100k+ investment? Would you buy a car from just looking at the salesperson's brochure? Probably not.
That isn't an answer to the question that was asked. Again--there are three sides to this equation--students who make a large investment in a legal education in the expectation that they will find work that pays sufficiently to justify such an investment; schools that offer an expensive education that presumably prepares students to perform such work; and state bars that license graduates to perform such work. Are not all three responsible for their respective decisions? Why then are the graduates the only parties being made to pay a price?
Nor has anyone addressed why, if the only employment available is for "high-powered" attorneys who presumably can only be the product of 14 schools, or doc reviewers, who can be the product of any "mediocre" school, that the other schools continue to admit so many students, and state bars continue to license so many practioners.
Why not make an announcement that we simply have all the lawyers we need, and everyone who does not get into at least Cornell should go do something else? That seems like a simple, supply-side solution.
Yeah, right, 10:18.
You forget that education is an INDUSTRY. A MONEYMAKER. Where would all these professors and administrators go if there weren't second, third, fourth-tier schools? They'd fight to the death so as not to have their bread and butter taken away. (Or should I say their "host" taken away, since they're PARASITES.)
They opened up the legal field to people who shouldn't have become lawyers, who had no business becoming lawyers. These are people of all races and both sexes. More students = more profits, for both the schools and the student loan companies.
THERE ARE TOO MANY LAWYERS ALREADY!
And don't forget that our society has popularized the ideal of "Univeral Education For All." This means that people who aren't necessarily worthy or intelligent are getting Bachelor's degrees (they're pushed through the system), as well as advanced degrees. These people would've been laborers or secretaries 30, 40, 50 years ago. Now they're college grads, lawyers, accountants, etc. with a possibly heavy student loan debt and a sense of entitlement because of their 'educational accomplishments'.
Follow the money! You'll never get lost!
10:52: Could you possibly be a bigger loser? Or perhaps you are just an internet troll who is really a high school student. Calling "names"?? Get a life.
Really.
11:09: after all the people Eileen Lamboy at Update has fucked over, blacklisted, been arrogant & nasty to, and generally treated like shit, she deserves everything she's getting now.
"I started school in 2001 and the crap state of the market was evident to anyone with a brain. There was a recession."
When there are fewer jobs for college grads, those grads will go somewhere. For a lot of them, that somewhere was law school. A lot of people thought that by the time they graduated, the economy would have recovered.
Back to the original post. It is my experience that the firm will never admit to any problem with "Ally." They will tolerate 90% turnover and low production for quarters before they will ever admit that they hired and trusted an incompetant ass. "It's the workers fault," they will say.
As far as them tracing the comments; well, no one stalks down a lie.
Look how the ABA supports contract attorneys:
http://www.abanet.org/lpm/ltt/articles/vol1/is6/firewire/index.shtml
"Indeed, some experts predict that U.S. law firms and other entities will outsource up to 40,000 legal jobs by 2010, and twice that many by 2015."
I was once a contract attorney, very briefly, and upon realizing how dead-end the position was, I worked my a** off and secured an associate position at a top firm. Temps are, unfortunately, often micro-managed because of the overwhelming unprofessional attitude that many temps take toward their jobs- I have seen temps sleeping on the job, making hour long personal calls, and instant messaging friends for hours as opposed to coding...all while billing the client. If you want to be respected in any profession, you must earn respect through your actions. Simply securing a law degree and passing a bar exam is not enough to earn you respect if your work ethic and work product are consistently substandard. And, if the conditions on these projects are as bad as you all describe, which was not my experience when I was a contract attorney, then simply quit and secure a full-time salaried position somewhere. I don't really see how this blog will change anything other than possibly providing a forum for temps to vent frustrations. That said, best of luck with your fight...or your job search.
8:19, put a cork in it. You're a fraud.
Here comes the venom spewing loser again. Thinks this blog is the bathroom wall in High School. TOM: I can't believe you let this loser internet troll beast run loose on here.
10:40: Glad no agency wants to work with you. Clearly your hate comes from the fact that you can't even get a temp gig bc you've been blacklisted. AMEN!
3:28: guess that means more $30/hr update jobs for you.
With all the bashing of psycopathic supervisors that goes on here, why is no time dedicated to the worst, psychopathic former supertemp of all, Foster Gibbons over at Pfizer? Shameful, really.
Deleting comments. This blog has gone downhill.
Blacklist? What blacklist? Soon all these jobs will be done by a bunch of brown skinned Indians -- exactly what I have been asking my firm (a large one) to do. Funny thing is, we will still use the same agencies, Update, Lex, Hudson. We just don't need the drama these overpaid losers in America provide.
Have a nice time in the umemployment line you fucking useless temps!
Anonymous said...
I was once a contract attorney, very briefly, and upon realizing how dead-end the position was, I worked my a** off and secured an associate position at a top firm.
So why didn't you just work your ass off and secure an associate position with a top firm in the first place? Because you didn't initially realize how dead-end being a contract attorney is? Please . . .
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