Hi Tom, it's Skadden Farts - here is my JD Underground post with my thoughts on "going solo." Feel free to re-post on your site under my name "Skadden Farts"
Here's a nice intro for the new guest post that I wrote:
Remember in the "glory days" of doc review how many coders harbored the starry-eyed pipedream of one day "going solo?" Hell, some even passed out business cards on the projects for their little shitlaw "side practices", most of which were nothing more than a stack of flimsy Vista-Print business cards and a mail-drop address. In the restrooms and hallways of Biglaw, many a coder's cell phone hummed with $750 real-estate closings and other sad, bottom-feeding crap, hoping to supplement the pathetic $35 an hour shitrate with some real "lawyering" on the side. With doc review now all but gone, many may now attempt "the plunge" into solo practice full-time. It's understandable. For most former NYC coders the options are few and far between: boiler room craigslist "firms" paying south of 40 K, moving to Cleveland for $20 an hour, or simply committing suicide. One can't really blame these poor souls for the harboring the delusion of self-employment. But.....
Fact is, with 100 K+ of student loan debt, the typical "shingle hanger" will be hung out to dry.
Skadden Farts aka Law is 4 Losers
Going "solo, eh? Have your checked your local Yellow Pages lately? Just count the number of attorneys begging for rinky-dink auto accident, DWI, and divorce/wills/ general shitlaw crap. Then tack on even more lawyers who don't (or can't afford to) advertise in the yellow pages. Then, for areas like personal injury, count the number of television commercials on daytime TV from the "national" feeder/referral PI firms like Jacoby and Meyers et al.
See what I'm getting at? The saturation level is staggering; really beyond comprehension. Scratching out a living in solo shitlaw is like selling saltwater on a lifeboat: people are already surrounded (literally drowning in)an endless supply of a totally worthless commodity: SHITLAW LAWYERS!
Come on, how many DWI's are there in a given suburban county/town? Read the local paper's police blotter. In a whole week maybe 15-20 (a few more on holiday weekends like 4th of July etc).
How many of the 15 or 20 DWI victims have even $2500 to pay a lawyer (and that's the low end of the scale for DWI)? Many are unemployed for Christ's sake and that's why they're drinking! Any of the higher-class types probably already know a lawyer from their peer group or will Google something like "NJ DWI LAW" and get the "mills" that can spend enough for a high Google bump. With 150 K in debt from a shitlaw school and no experience to practice law anyway, why the fuck is anyone going to retain you in the first place? Even shitlaw areas are somewhat complicated and involve at least 98,357 pages of tedious hypertechnical make-work paper churning and hours of sitting in shit-court at 10 pm waiting to argue with a nasty part-time troll "judge" who himself is a nasty, balding loser and lords his Napoleon complex over the pathetic night-court riff raff to inflate his own sorry ego. "Your honor" my ass. That robe means as much as a kid's Halloween costume.
Same way with small-time criminal work. If a guy had $2500 to pay a defense lawyer, would he be robbing a 7/11 or prying someone's window open at 2 am to steal a DVD player he can pawn for $20 to score a bag of crack?
"Family" law? Pray tell! For every hedge-fund divorce there are tons of trailer-trash people who reek of kerosene and haven't a pot to piss in or window to throw it out of, much less money to pay a lawyer a retainer + hourly rate. Half these losers will just use legal aid or a form company like "We the People" and toast their newly-found freedom from Bubba the wife beater with a can of Keystone Light and some crystal meth. They didn't and won't need a worthless shitlaw "lawyer" to help with custody of their obnoxious maladjusted satan-children who will probably grow up and score a 136 on the LSAT and attend Cooley's night program, bringing "prestige" to their family when they earn $13 an hour on a doc review in Newark NJ in 2018!
Wills and estates? Ever heard of Legalzoom? They have the same shitlaw templates from your CLE books for ordinary (non-millionaire) folks to print out and take to a notary for $50. And at the rate of this meltdown no one's going to have much to leave anyone anyway. High-end estate & trust clients are all referred to their lawyer by an investment adviser. Any investment guy worth his salt already has a 92 year old gray-beard expert estate lawyer that he feeds all the referrals to. Good luck breaking into this niche area. Stockbrokers aren't sending their rich clients to a newly minted shitlawyer who doesn't understand the nuances of IRS Sub-Code 45-B(II)V with regard to bilateral spousal exemptions under revised footnote 567(b)9 of the 2005 semi-annual quantum stimulus updates.
And even doing a proletarian's shit-will you still have to meet the losers and make nice for an hour, then hire a moron to type up the needed shitpaper (or waste an hour cutting and pasting it yourself), then have 'em come back AGAIN and explain idiotic legalese shit like "per stirpes" and then find witnesses, etc while also pretending you actually did something worth paying for. A huge headache and hassle to make $200 or whatever shitlaw wills go for in your town.
Or you could try the nightmarish (and all but totally dead now) field of residential real estate closings. Have fun filling out 75,357 pages HUD-1 forms and other pointless God-awful dreck, balancing trust accounts, cutting 18,253 different checks, dealing with scumbag title agencies, and having people bicker for hours over a $15 broken light switch at 1 am the night before closing. All so you can get a FLAT FEE of $750 for 73 hours of grunt work while a bimbo realtor w/ a GED and big tits walks away w/ a 5 grand commission and laughs in your face.
See kids, you can't charge more than "market rate" in your area for shitlaw. People do price shop (esp. in real estate closings- these people often use a lawyer referred by the realtor who wants someone cheap so that the deal goes thru). No realtor is going to recommend an expensive shitlaw closing lawyer because any $$$ to the lawyer is more chance the deal might break apart. Even very good real estate lawyers admit the practice area is decimated. Lawyers in the 1970s and 1980s used to get a percentage of the sale price as a fee for a typical closing. Now the rate is $750 flat no matter how long it takes. That's law. You make practice more and more miserable and complicated, while simultaneously reducing lawyer pay to sub-poverty levels. Layers and layers of added shitpaper for a smaller pile of dough. Welcome to Law 2009! In inflation-adjusted dollars (hell, even in "raw" dollars) most shitlaw lawyers are doing exponentially worse than their counterparts of 20 or 30 years ago were. This trend cannot improve and indeed will get worse as the ABA accredits more schools and shameless liars like Pat Hobbs fill diploma mills like Seton Hall to the rafters with over-leveraged liberal arts losers.
Personal injury was for years the main revenue source for most "shitlaw" lawyers. A "wild card" of sorts. Those days are gone. Time was, every shitlaw lawyers could count on at least an auto case or two a month. Back then (1920 to about 2001)soft tissue auto cases used to settle pre-suit for 15-20 K. Now they settle for ZERO thanks to tough "threshold" laws. And even decent cases (like broken bones and surgeries)are harder and harder to get money on quickly, because insurance companies have lost billions in bad investments and tightened the screws on pay-outs across the board. Insurance defense "lawyers" are so cheap thanks to the oversupply that its easy to fight off the plaintiffs until they give up. And many have given up.
Check craigslist in your area under "Legal Services" and you'll see scores of lawyers "outbidding" each other to do the cheapest DWI or traffic ticket or real estate closing or whatever. Its a fact of life.
As the economy continues its meltdown, less and less "ordinary folks" will have the dough to pay even cheap lawyers.
Fact is, almost no newbie solo will be able to generate the volume of business needed to sustain a living. The numbers just don't work. Deduct paying your own health insurance (300+ a month), office rent, self-employment tax, malpractice insurance, etc. You have to get a relatively steady flow of PAYING clients just to break even, much less profit.
There is no way any rational person can "spin" a TTT law degree into a good investment, or any kind of investment period. It is a costly & worthless albatross that will be worth less tomorrow than today as the morbid oversupply of lawyers continues unabated and, sadly, accelerates. There is no way from here but down.
72 comments:
Thanks! I feel better already!
- Killself
The "Slaves of New York" are finally being freed from their chains. The combination of the economy and outsourcing is finally winding down this horrible industry that has spawned whole blogs full of hate toward their employers! Rejoice all, as you are winning, you will no longer be forced to be a $35/hour+OT temp in a basement and are free to go out and make money on your own now, instead of doing all the work and letting the agencies and firms collect most of what you are due! Victory is yours!
Scadden Farts RULES! BRAVO!
The "Slaves of New York" are merely being replaced by the "Slaves of Mumbai". In Mumbai, hopefully they won't have those pesky labor laws to deal with and will be allowed to beat their slaves with a stick.
That's right 2:17, you tell 'em!! How dare people want decent working conditions at their jobs! Clearly the only choice is being dumped on or jobless poverty.
No way but down--for an asswipe that can't spell, proofread, or take the time to correct typos.
The hungry, connected, skilled and/or dedicated will be the ones left. The rest of you can piss off and become Peace Corps workers. I hear they waive your loans.
http://anonymouscontractlawyer.blogspot.com
Fellow contract attorneys, don't fear change. Embrace the horror!
The "career" is a joke--my jd is worthless--
More whiny self entitled biglaw types. Now I get it, they are just using this blog as a pretext for the unauthorized practice of law. What a race to the gutter.
I'm convinced that the next wave is to outsource the associates. Think about all the money to made by the greedy corporations and the ABA. All of the fatcat outsourcing seminars, where people speak in hushed tones about how much money are saving over using those awful temps and agencies. The ABA can approve (wink * wink) accredited law schools in China and India.
Now they're free! They've gutted the profession, skirted labor laws, bar licensing, jd requirements, while disenfranchising tens of thousands of American attorneys, but they're free!
I think 2:17, you should take Senator Grassley's advice and commit Hari Kari or quit your job and stop abusing and harassing temps.
Stop being so condescending towards your trailer trash peers and potential clients. Your JD failed to entitle you to being above them. The truth is you have already entered the same income bracket as the low class social groups that you put down in your worthless rant. Yes, you are one of them now. Congratulations! Now get over it, you failed in your endeavour to become an elitist and all you can do is beat on those "below you" such as hard working Indians and blue collar folks to unleash your frustrations.
For years the legal profession has been treated like a cheap, two dollar whore.... and people are wondering why this profession is dying!
You've got a point about the economics of going solo, and to a point, about the nature of the work. In that sense, I can see the term "shitlaw" being a fair warning. But fuck you with your contempt for regular people and the lawyers that serve them, and pity on you for your apparent envy for the lawyers in "BigLaw" firms, who are all too often drones pushing corporate paper, sometimes in support of practices that impoverish regular people or do other social harm.
There are plenty of rewarding and intellectual challenging opportunities to help people out there, and sometimes it will put in the same court with a BigLaw partner, arguing as equals. Yes, their resources are overwhelming and you will probably lose, but you'll be fighting the good fight.
Making a living at that? No, it won't happen except for a few, and you are right that going into massive debt to do this is crazy. But many people have already done that. Don't discourage these people from using their education and status as a lawyer to do well in this world.
Seeking work outside law is probably smarter for many people than trying to solo. But keep your bar card and your skills current, and when you see an opportunity to help someone getting screwing by government, a coporation, or the courts, see if you can do it. Don't leave law to the big firms - bring their clients into court. A million "shit lawyers" doing this could stir up some good shit, mostly just enforcing laws already on the books.
This is probably as unrealistic as going solo, especially if you have huge loans. But stop demeaning the idealistic side of this profession. The realtor might make more money for less work and with less education, but law is a higher calling.
You've got a point about the economics of going solo, and to a point, about the nature of the work. In that sense, I can see the term "shitlaw" being a fair warning. But fuck you with your contempt for regular people and the lawyers that serve them, and pity on you for your apparent envy for the lawyers in "BigLaw" firms, who are all too often drones pushing corporate paper, sometimes in support of practices that impoverish regular people or do other social harm.
There are plenty of rewarding and intellectual challenging opportunities to help people out there, and sometimes it will put in the same court with a BigLaw partner, arguing as equals. Yes, their resources are overwhelming and you will probably lose, but you'll be fighting the good fight.
Making a living at that? No, it won't happen except for a few, and you are right that going into massive debt to do this is crazy. But many people have already done that. Don't discourage these people from using their education and status as a lawyer to do well in this world.
Seeking work outside law is probably smarter for many people than trying to solo. But keep your bar card and your skills current, and when you see an opportunity to help someone getting screwing by government, a coporation, or the courts, see if you can do it. Don't leave law to the big firms - bring their clients into court. A million "shit lawyers" doing this could stir up some good shit, mostly just enforcing laws already on the books.
This is probably as unrealistic as going solo, especially if you have huge loans. But stop demeaning the idealistic side of this profession. The realtor might make more money for less work and with less education, but law is a higher calling.
Quite honestly the entire "practice of law" is a sham. Our country was established by a constitution with enumerated rights. Why do we need a 3 year degree and a bar exam to entitle us to (realistic) protection under these rights?
We all know what a load of crap law school was (common law doesn't even apply except in the most general sense) and what a joke the bar exam is in terms of real life application.
Most of us (non-lawyers and lawyers outside of big law) are now victims of this scam. Sites like zoomlaw help expose this sham and will bring the end of inflated prices that came along with being "protected under the law." Hopefully this brings about the beginningof the end of an enforced cartel on "the law"
Unfortunately for us, the ones that took on large debt and went through the rigamarole of school and the exam - well we are truly screwed. All we can do is take aim at the big boys and fire. What else do we have to lose? Too bad nobody here has the balls to take action. Just a lot of talk.
4:07 - you make the supposition that everyone wants biglaw. It's not the case most people give up on biglaw after 1L.
The law is no longer a profession but rather as Skadden Farts described. It's jsut a sad, unprofessional gutter job. The practice of law has now officiall been commoditized.
It's over, will the last sleazy LPO huckster leaving the country turn the light out?
Agree with 5:45pm that this profession is a pyramid-style sham. Just think about it.
1) You have the top 10% on top making the money in a system that is set up to effectively block anyone below that inner elite circle to even have a shot at getting there. Meanwhile, the losing bottom layer, which is always larger, needs to be replaced/refreshed periodically. Sounds familiar you think? The only change you will see in these economic times is that the winning top layer will temporarily contract and then expand again for a bit maybe in better times. The framework of the sham stays the same.
2) The biglaw fat cats line their pockets and justify their obscene rates by impressing their clients with mainly their prestigious names and pedigree, making them believe that anybody beneath them such as doc reviewers and TTT grads are incapable of performing that type of work in a satisfactory manner. This is a successful measure to prevent all of us from having a chance at their jobs and their money. Combined with the horrible debt-albatross around the neck of the middle and lower class law grads the fatcats have successfully crippled any potential that the overwhelming surplus of the remaining lawyers out therehave.
3) With the leverage gained by their elite name and pedigree not being enough to save some of these big firms from demise in today's situation, it is in the biglaw partners' interest to find a way to keep the floodgates closed and save their old house of cards by laying off staff, outsourcing, moving up start dates for associates etc. Notice that everyday facts such as that associates pick up the exact same review work now that temps used to do but get paid and bill the client at a much higher rate are an obvious indicator that this profession is still being operated like the same old total elitist sham that it's always been. Corners are now being cut with the aim to preserve the old boys structure as much as they can. Whoever is left is still getting paid well and there is a reason why reducing salaries is not a favorable cost cutting measure for these greedy fatcats. The old boys club may be smaller now, but their hope is that things will return to the same old again, meaning most of you will still be shut out from dignified opportunities in good times.
4) The bloated big firm salaries offered to the talent only encourage the numerous law diploma mills to raise their prices, making them more money in the end. Expect to see more of the same old to return if things get better - an unbalanced surplus of indebted holders of overpriced law degrees with no viable job prospects.
Any bright lawyer who has been deprived of career opportunities due to this old structure and wants to shape the future in his or her field ought to be inspired by the collapse of this industry to think of as many ways as possible to contribute to a quicker demolition of this opressive, outdated house of cards, plain and simple. The big firm actions not only affect those within the big firm environments, but have much further-reaching, devastating effects on the rest of this industry as well. Time to put your minds together at least and then take action!
ok- Skadden Farts is bitter. We get it. So do something else with your life instead of spreading negative energy. Or drop out of law school if you're still there.
Yeah, everything sucks. I GET it! What's the point of bitching about it for page long posts?
This blog would be so good if people actually posted USEFUL insights instead of bitching bitching bitching. Dear Christ, go get some Prozac.
Nigerian Student To Serve 19 Years In Prison For Internet Scam http://bit.ly/12vDzj
7:32 - your odd posts looks strangely like bitching.
7:32 feels entitled to bleat his puny elite-friendly "opinion," don't he?
Useful insights? Like what. Posts like this are necessary to shine a little light about what being a solo is actually like.
You can delve into his motives for attending law school in the first place but you really cannot question the truth and content of his words. "Skadden Farts" aka Law Is 4 Losers aka Scotty Bullock hits a home run with that post in a deadly accurate way.
Without the once profitable and lucrative document review law is a dead end for all but the few truly brilliant and members of the Preferred, Protected and or seriously Connected classes.
Check out this promotional video from Cardozo law school.
http://www.cardozo.yu.edu/
MemberContentDisplay.aspx?ccmd=ContentDisplay&ucmd=
UserDisplay&userid=10336&contentid=884
The old, wrinkled wretch at the end of the video who talks about "changing the world" is a partner at Fried Frank, a horrible, bloodsucking firm that abuses temps for all they are worth.
I worked at Fried Frank once, and it was the most miserable time of my life. We were forced to work 24/7 and were supervised by this psychotic lesbo, whose primary aim was to drive as many of us into the loony bin as possible. I contemplated suicide on a daily basis after working at that hell hole.
"The old, wrinkled wretch at the end of the video who talks about "changing the world" is a partner at Fried Frank, a horrible, bloodsucking firm that abuses temps for all they are worth."
So in this economy that would be?? $1?
Please people don't complain about Scott Bullock, he's a voice for the doc reviewers and has the balls to push the truth into the mainstream media.
He has balls, something 99% of the posters here don't have because you fucking whine all day and do nothing about it.
You're lawyers for Christ sake use your knowledge and training to do something about this mess.
And its better to fight against the ABA and outsourcing (And now is the time with Obama) than just "consider solo practice." That leads to divorce and personal bankruptcy for many...Only a few succeed and those people are all A personality types, natural salespersons and entreupenurial.
What a whiny bunch of bullshit. BTW, DWI "victims" are the folks who were killed, injured or lost a family member to a drunk driver. Just so you know.
This is simply priceless:
"Family" law? Pray tell! For every hedge-fund divorce there are tons of trailer-trash people who reek of kersosene and haven't a pot to piss in or window to throw it out of, much less money to pay a lawyer a retainer + hourly rate. Half these losers will just use legal aid or a form company like "We the People" and toast their newly-found freedom from Bubba the wifebeater with a can of Keystone Light and some crystal meth. They didn't and won't need a worthless shitlaw "lawyer" to help with custody of their obnoxious maladjusted satan-children who will probably grow up and score a 136 on the LSAT and attend Cooley's night program, bringing "prestige" to their family when they earn $13 an hour on a doc review in Newark NJ in 2018!
It doesn't get any funnier or truer than that. Well said.
I have been reading this blog since September shortly before losing my position in a firm (not document review). I knew the lay-off was coming in the face of the financial meltdown. I hoped to gain information that would assist me in gaining new employment. While there have been some helpful posts, I have had to wade through an awful amount of garbage and self-pity to find it.
While I did not attend a top tier law school, I was in the top 10% of my class and had a prior professional career. Unfortunately, as the ageists on this site might note, it appeared from the reactions I was getting in these past months that I was too old to breathe, much less practice law. Nevertheless, despite the dearth of opportunities, I persevered and have now been offered a position that affords real growth opportunity on a partnership track as well as the opportunity to develop an underserved niche area of law practice. As such, I very much doubt I will have the time or any reason in the future to visit this site anymore. Accordingly, I take this opportunity to post my observations regarding the myriad of comments I have read on this site in the past six months.
1. For those of you who posted useful information such as the names of document review agencies or the posselist, I thank you. While I did register with the agencies and was prepared to do document reviews if necessary, I must admit that I am relieved that will not be the case. It was also very comforting during this period to know that I was not alone as I did suffer some bouts of depression. I guess misery does love company.
2. To the racists, misogynists and ageists out there, get over yourself. Your parents did you a disservice by allowing you to believe you were entitled to anything more than a chance like anyone else. Instead of permitting you to run amok so as not to suppress your "inner child", they should have taught you some basic manners and social skills. Case in point, when I went up to one of the agencies to register, I was given paperwork to be completed. Three people were sitting in the reception area with no additional room to sit. Two very young self-entitled males looked up at me and scowled. A young Nigerian woman looked up, smiled politely and moved her coat so that I could sit. Take a lesson. Guess who I would rather sit next to at a review (before you tote out that tired old "weapon" in your sexist arsenal- no, I am not a lesbian). If you want to know who the enemy is, have a long hard look in the mirror. You will go to the grave with a chip on your shoulders blaming everyone one else for your failures. I pity you.
3. To the Indians, Nigerians, "old" people (apparently anyone over 30), "chicks" (after 40 years of feminism, I can't believe that phrase still exists), fat people and anyone else denigrated by #2 above, just remember, they are #2 in every sense of the phrase. Responding to their drivel is just a waste of time and effort. Knowing their fate should be satisfaction enough.
4. To the vast majority of you who I suspect visit this site for the same reasons I did and like me, rarely post, I wish you all the luck in the world. Despite your current circumstances, I urge you to maintain your integrity, personal morality and professional demeanor. This is the first time that I have suffered a period of protracted unemployment as an attorney. I am no stranger to lay-offs, however, as my prior career as an engineer was in a cyclical area. Therefore, I can tell you from personal experience that as dire as my circumstances seemed in each of those instances, in retrospect those lay-offs afforded me opportunities that would not have otherwise presented themselves and sent me in different, better directions. While it sounds trite, I urge you to keep your chins up, things DO turn out for the best. The best of luck to all of you.
First, there was junklaw.
Then, there was craplaw.
Then, there was shitlaw.
After that, there was fucklaw.
Now, there is fuckthisgoddamshitiwanttovomitonyourdirtystinkingcorpseyougoddamcocksuckingmotherfuckerlaw.
We have made progress, my friends.
Real progress.
2:17, FU u dumb f'nnng pig. you are either to fat or too skinny. and anyone you are in a relationship with cheats on you and makes fun of you behind your back.
And your parents really did not like you and were f'd up as well so you were embarassed.
go jump
Let's go people!
Get a list all the current jobs going, agencies running, # of reviewers, and rates.
Is there review still out there.
?
Let's go people!
Get a list all the current jobs going, agencies running, # of reviewers, and rates.
Is there review still out there.
?
Go to Facebbok and search "Discovery-E-Solutions" to find the latest job postings
No, the site on Facebbok you are referring to is call "Discover-E-Solutions" and should be typed just like that otherwise it does not appear. The facebook search engine is not very good.
fuk u put the fukkin information here u motherfuckerr
Fukni fuk u for not doing it yet.
Regarding:
"And even doing a proletarian's shit-will you still have to meet the losers and make nice for an hour, then hire a moron to type up the needed shitpaper"
and among others as the asshole who thought he can borrow his way into the upper class, I don't think this asshole deserves a job anyway. 4:07 is right, and I suspect (s)he will be more successful than this asshole trash.
If you note the lack of class in the post, it is hard to understand how asshole trash had any delusions of being elite. I bet he thought he could buy (borrow) his way in: expensive cigars and the like. Pathetic.
The solo practice is terrible. Collecting fees from the private client is impossible... most have no retainers either. They have money for their beer or to maintain their Harleys, but not for a lawyer.
Jacoby and Meyers used to handle all matters until they realized personal injury work was the only lucrative area. They collect the settlement, take their fee and dispurse the remainder to the client....otherwise, they would never get paid.
The general private client is thankless. The have "big problems and empty pockets" to quote a well known trial attorney I had the pleasure of knowing. I would advise staying out of that field. The author of the blog is correct.
You would be better off trying to get the overflow pool attorney work from the public defender's office. At least then, the state is paying to represent jerk-offs.
Personal injury and immigration are the two safest areas of private practice. At least with immigration, you represent an illegal alien who pays cash. If you screw the application up, your foreign fuck client doesn't know any better regardless...and who is he going to complain to? The ABA because he failed to become a citizen?
The whole profession is nuts. Document review is numbing and mindless, but there is a check at the end of the week.
Personal injury and immigration are the two safest areas of private practice
_________________________
Personal injury in areas like NY and NJ is so saturated, and you have to compete with huge firms that have massive TV and radio ads. The only way to get clients is to make "friends" with shady medical mills and clinics and pay them illegal kickbacks for referring you cases. Period.
and there are very, very few good cases out there in personal injury. Most of the stuff id soft-tissue auto, and these cases have become so hard to settle (impossible actually if allstate or state farm is the carrier) that many of these little PI shops are closing down.
@ 1:27 AM
Excellent points. Things will turn around, new and better opportunities will appear because we are masters of our own destinies.
The staffing agencies are going bye bye right now - obliterated by the economy. Also, most big law/corporate HR/legal departments now realize that these staffing agencies lost their way. Insiders know the agencies took it too far with sweatshops, blacklists and favoritism.
Insiders also know that these companies are now embroiled in litigation filed by attorneys who were supposedly mistreated in these "sweatshops". You might not have heard of these cases, but they do exist. These cases have even ensnared outside counsel and clients by causing them to become parties to these suits - at least in some circumstances.
A few agencies will survive. Most will no longer exist.
The LPOs are trying to curry favor with biglaw.
Soon, the US legal profession will look like this:
1) 25% greedy biglaw partners milking clients and bilking the public
2) 25% biglaw associates on their way to the breadlines
3) 25% unemployed temps suing biglaw for outsourcing and unemployed new JDs suing law schools for false advertising
4) 25% document reviewers working on doc review projects in the cases mentioned in #3
12:59 - Not punny.
1:05 - Can we get 'another' 25% suing schools for misleading/fraudulent salary statistics post graduation?
So, I got an e-mail (not a mass one) asking me if I'm available for a temp associate position. Hell, yeah. I left a message and sent an e-mail saying I'm avilable and interested. No one got back to me!
I'm used to agencies ignoring my messages/calls- but this time a message was sent to me personally asking if "I" (not a hundred other people) was available! What the fuck is going on here? I tried calling again today- no response.
If Jesus were a lawyer, would he be a doc reviewer since he consorted with the low lifes and more importantly which agency would he work for?
It's the same all over. I'm hearing from other African American attorneys that they are being told by agencies there no reviews currently being staffed, but are then informed by white attorneys working for the same staffing agencies that they were called and offered doc rev positions the same day. Many sisters are beginning to wonder if some of the staffing agencies have a preference for white doc review attorneys since most of the recruiters are white themselves. You know, the "look out for your own kind" mentality!
It's the same all over. I'm hearing from other African American attorneys that they are being told by agencies there no reviews currently being staffed, but are then informed by white attorneys working for the same staffing agencies that they were called and offered doc rev positions the same day. Many sisters are beginning to wonder if some of the staffing agencies have a preference for white doc review attorneys since most of the recruiters are white themselves. You know, the "look out for your own kind" mentality!
3:03-
Or maybe the agency took reviewers who happened to have more dr experience and they happened to be white. Instead of explaining all that, they just said, 'sorry- no doc review.'
I've met a lot of recruiters who are black/Asian/Latino themselves, so it wouldn't make much sense for them to be racist.
Unfortunately, I've learned from this blog that its the doc reviewers themselves who are racist.
Law, save for the Barak Obama Harvard types, is NOT for American born black folk. Period. Save for a very fortunate rare few, American born decendants of southern slave are almost universally shut out from anything in "law" that is profitable or worthwhile regardless of any fraudulent attempts by the so-called legal "profession" to appear to be "inclusive".
Law is a caste system that is built upon elitist, classist, vehemently racist and ageist tendencies. Its all about pedigree and if you don't have the correct pedigree then you are an untouchable. Deal with it.
4:04-
Um...yeah. That's probably why I'm friends with so many black lawyers who have decent legal jobs.
Oh- and these friends of mine are "American-born black folk" in case you were wondering.
It's just one nigger barbecue over at DeNovo
ummmm...been on projects at De Novo and they seem to have a high number of minorities.
asshole who thought he can borrow his way into the upper class, I don't think this asshole deserves a job anyway.
Perfect description of L4L. All of the members of the "Scott Bullock is a truth-telling hero!" cult are really just another group of lemmings.
They refuse to acknowledge one simple truth--he's mad because he didn't get Biglaw. The end. If every other statement he made about the profession were still true, but HE had gotten the $160k plum, we never would have heard a peep from this whiner. His continuing screeds don't reflect bravery, they reflect bitterness, and nothing more.
Hey 4:53, Did you ever consider that maybe your friends (you) aren't getting on any projects for other reasons? Like maybe they suck as reviewers,call out sick every other day, or have nasty attitudes. Ever cross your mind? Or are you content to just rely on the race card. I think with the election of a black president it's about time to give up on the racial discrimination thing. Getting a bit old and tired.
Hey 4:53, Did you ever consider that maybe your friends (you) aren't getting on any projects for other reasons?
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Why aren't you getting projects? Because of the black president?
There is one thing someone with a TTT law degree can do with it. Start a business doing something other than law and be your own in house counsel.
9:59
Nope, I have a perm job, so I don't have to worry. LOL.
Anonymous said...
9:59
Nope, I have a perm job, so I don't have to worry. LOL.
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You mean the black president hasn't taken your (undoubtedly) well-deserved "perm" job away? I'm shocked!
9:59-Nope, and if I got fired, I would look to my own inadequacies first and not look for a convenient scape goat. For instance, if my boss (who is not white) fired me, I would not automatically assume it was because I was white. I would think maybe it was because I was on the internet all day long instead of working. Which I usually am. Then, when I got my next job, I would work a little harder and stop goofing off. Stop playing the race card, and if you do, at least try to have a little more proof. Do you honestly think minorities are under-represented in the doc review world?
Anonymous said...
9:59-if I got fired, I would look to my own inadequacies first and not look for a convenient scape goat. For instance, if my boss (who is not white) fired me, I would not automatically assume it was because I was white.
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Who said the poster AUTOMATICALLY assumed anything because of their race? Why did you AUTOMATICALLY assume that was their immediate assumption? Isn't that "playing the race card," to dismiss a complaint out of hand because it mentions race, without any kind of critical examination?
And maybe YOU should look at your inadequacies for an explanation for your lot in life, because your English reading and writing skills, as well as your ability to reason, ARE quite inadequate--I know you thought being white protected you from that kind of judgment, but it doesn't.
Above all, you don't have any idea what situation that poster is in, but because they suggested it COULD have a racial component, you immediately concluded they were "playing the race card." You are a Dittohead ass.
Thanks 5:40. I'm pretty content with my lot in life. Why would you assume I wasn't?
Also, I must confess,you were right. The following in no way constitutes an assumption:
" Many sisters are beginning to wonder if some of the staffing agencies have a preference for white doc review attorneys since most of the recruiters are white themselves. You know, the "look out for your own kind" mentality!"
When you have a weak argument, always resort to name calling. Everyone will realize the true scholar you are when you call someone an ass.
Also, I must confess,you were right. The following in no way constitutes an assumption:
"Many sisters are beginning to wonder if some of the staffing agencies have a preference for white doc review attorneys since most of the recruiters are white themselves. You know, the "look out for your own kind" mentality!"
In what way is "wondering" if a staffing agency is racially discriminating the same as "automatically assuming" they are, or "assuming" they are at all?
An "assumption" is defined in the English language as "something taken for granted; a supposition," i.e., precisely the opposite of a group of a group of people comparing notes on their individual experiences and "beginning to wonder" if it may have some greater significance.
Again, it is YOU, who made the assumption about how and why these people began "wondering" as they did. And if my argument were weak, you (or someone more intelligent) could refute it; the fact that I simply pointed out that you're a Dittohead ass who screams "race-card" like some kind of demented parrot any time a non-white person mentions race only further reflects the truth of that descriptor. Get over it. Nobody is going to fall silent about this bullshit anymore because you start screeching about "the race-card" and "excuse-making," when this board consists of the biggest group of excuse-making, other-blaming whiners on the planet.
First of all, calm down. There is no need to be so hostile.
Second, before the sista starts "wondering" about discrimination, she should perhaps do a little more research. Just because a sista knows a white person or two that is starting a project,and a black person or two that is not, doesn't mean that the agencies are discriminating based on race. Even "wondering" based on that evidence is ridiculous.
"Nobody is going to fall silent about this bullshit anymore"
What "bullshit" are you referring to? Is it the racism that the sista is "wondering" about?
Bottom line: most people with a JD have (or at least at some point had) above-average drive and ability. Amongst those people there are many with additional skill-sets that would make them highly marketable in areas outside of legal practice. If you're one of them, you might be better off pursuing a non-legal path and hopefully find that your life will change for the better.
Trust me, even those highly-acclaimed 'Big-Law' jobs are no substitute for fulfillment in life.
Also, I have advised many people who approached me with advice about the pros and cons of going to Law School to ensure that they do so, if they can't help it, with a minimum of debt or none at all.
The diploma mills must dry out naturally. They way to do it is to continue supplying enough information to make people understand the realities of this industry.
Good Luck to all!
worked with my father,in law, since 13. always worked with one other attorney or alone. never lost a case.
in desperation, wrote to bcg, and told we only want attorneys from large firms.
good bye and good luck.
can we get cyanide online?
Wow, I thought lawyers were supposed to be professionals.
What a bunch of crybabies.
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